And I dont study my Bible enough and would say no one does. So many churches have lost wonderful ministry opportunties by turning away those hurting, divorced folks, its a shame, God help us all to be sensitive to those who are hurting all around us. Blessings & againIm so sorry you were hurt like that you & your family. 1. In 1539 thirty one more who had fled to Holland were apprehended and martyred there. No church in the NT took that label. Like friends of my son who were in Mexico recently. Soul liberty is a belief that everyone is responsible to God individually. Before the America won its independence and the Constitution became law, the Episcopal church, which was the American branch of the Church of England, was the only legal church in Virginia. The Gospel is to be preached throughout the world by believers empowered by the Holy Spirit as Acts 1:8 plainly states. I have never believed in obedience to a pastor just obedience to Gods Word All systems of hierarchy set up by man over the authority of the local church has lead to doctrinal errors and corruption without exception and God has not party with them. https://www.victorybaptistharvey.com victorybaptistharvey@gmail.com. (I do love acapella singing, btw.). These worldly churches still call themselves Baptists but in fact they do not believe or practice what true Baptists have historically believed and more importantly what the Word of God says. As for relating to other denominations and Catholocs, I believe that that is also harmful if one is not strong enough in their faith. Those good Church of Christ folks, I have a few friends in that faith, good folks, but as youve so clearly pointed out, completley out in left field as it relates to musical instruments in the church. Our Pastor teaches that Baptism does not save us and is no a requirement of salvation. The church government of many Independent Baptist churches are to have pastors and deacons as officers of the local church. I would like comment on each trait if you dont mind: I posted my last post like 3 days ago and it just came up recently. No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day., Based on the Word of God, I submit to you that Gods plan will not be thwarted because I fail to do something. Again Im not sure what the Word of God sais about dress. Look at Ezekiel 33. Proverbs 21:24, Proud and haughty scorner is his name, who dealeth in proud wrath. It seems as if the preacher thinks it is within his ability to persuade people to accept Christ or to get people to witness or whatever. Baptists strongly insist that Gods Word is not up for arbitration or subject to the individuals, groups, denominations or churchs private interpretation. Im referring to a mistake I made in my fairly long comment, which you may not have seen yet, once you do youll understand I was correcting a statement in my next to last paragraph. There he became the pastor of the Puritan church. In 1638, he landed in Boston and settled for a short time in Piscataway (now Dover) in New Hampshire. Yes, we do preach not to be unequally yolked with non-belivers and I agree with that. Also, from personal expreicnei know how it feels to be spirtually abused. Ok so he starts attempting to pull the heart strings about loved ones that you are around daily, and if you are telling them enough about getting saved etc. The Independent Baptist believes that to join with churches who teach and practice false doctrine is condone and even show approval of Biblical error and that all doctrinal error is sin. We are not under law. Independent Fundamental Churches of America, https://www.britannica.com/topic/Independent-Fundamental-Churches-of-America, Official Site of IFCA International, Grandville, Michigan, United States. Its is true that many Baptists left the ranks of Protestant churches which were doctrinal unsound and apostate. If I wanted to wear a sponge bob costume while leading worship I probably would not be allowed to do this in most Churches. The center of Baptist activity in the colonies was in the Philadelphia area, and Baptists held regular general meetings of the churches for devotional and evangelistic purposes there. I attend an Independent Baptist church and Ill answer your questions We give out of thankfulness to God for what Christ has accomplished as we are led by the Spirit. Is this really what youre doing here? A response to Pastor James Meltons Questions for the KJV Critics, 69. It may be this passage of Scripture Paul had in mind when he said I am innocent of the blood of all men because he had taught them the whole counsel of Gods word. He then began to ask me questions and we had a good conversation centered around God from there on. I would love to know your thoughts on the matter. @greg Firstly, they take a denominational name: Baptist. Its nothing personal, just logic. But not all Baptist churches are that way! Member churches are forbidden to affiliate with any denomination, and the fellowship, administered by annually elected trustees, cannot organize itself as a denomination. I have gone to Dayspring in Wisconsin and Hillcrest in El Paso and both have apps if you want to check them out. Ive become weary of those labels, and the Baptist one carries alot of baggage now. He soon embraced Separatists ideas and decided to leave England. So I wonder again is this God desire or your thing? I find it difficult sometimes to keep Gods sovereignty and my responsibility in balance. Such as The Church of Christ? http://www.av1611.org/ this web site is dial-the-truth ministries, but I call them dial-the-. Even after Williams left it, it continued to follow the New Testament and was not adversely effected. As a matter of fact, you cannot be a member of a Calvary Chapel. Although we gladly accept donations offered it is not required. 1 Peter 3:16, Having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. The Puritans were dissenters from the Church of England. 2 Timothy 3:16, All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. We also have a man that shouts Amen as well. When a congregation results from the preaching of the Gospel, authenticating that congregation as a New Testament church rests solely on its doctrine and practice.not in its affiliation. 3. But this article simply exposes the Baptist system as just another denomination among tens of thousands. About modesty, my wife and I attended a concert that my sons band performed at a teen group in a neighboring town. One man Hanserd Knolleys, is an example of dissenter of the Church of England who had to flee to America. This church had no ties to anyone or any other church, yet this was a Baptist church as much as any Baptist church ever was. I certainly need Gods help to do the things He has asked me to do. v-43 Stop grumbling among yourselves, Jesus answered. I am an IFB. I feel silly because some of the things I stood up for on this site are the same things that made me leave. You dont study enough. The New Testament teaches the absolute autonomy of each local church who is to govern itself as the Word of God instructs free from outside authority and control. Later Presbyterians, Episcopalians and Methodist were added to the lists of Protestants denominations. He strongly believed in separation of church and state and upheld the principles of soul liberty. We are a local New Testament church reaching the Phoenix area with the Gospel of Jesus Christ. They tried to establish that according to history, Baptists have an unbroken line of churches since Christ. No one in USA at least (whether IFB, CALVARLY CHAPEL, MOST CHURCHES, etc) tithe on all belongings at they practiced thier & our money/wealth/argicultural exchange & system is very different. The New Testament is the authority in all matters of faith and practice. There are a number of other wrong teachings w/in this church but the false teaching about baptism is far and away the biggest, some of the others are, not believing in eternal security, and close behind is not believing that one can know that you are saved. I was able to better understand the New Testament. Let us know if you have suggestions to improve this article (requires login). Members are encouraged to post contact information for such churches. The church government of many Independent Baptist churches are to have pastors and deacons as officers of the local church. They should not be confused true Bible believing churches, because their beliefs and practices were much like the Church of England. The true Independent Fundamental Baptists have no association or fellowship with these churches because they teach or practice things contrary to the New Testament. I dont like dressing up. Williams graduated from Cambridge University in 1627, and was apparently ordained in the Church of England. It certainly isnt about our adherance to a set of manmade rules. He preserved His word and the Word preserved a true Gospel witness during every moment of history since Pentecost. The mighty IFB has spoken It looks like I'm wasting my time. Its ugly and frustrating. Founded in June of 1980, International Baptist Missions is a ministry of Tri-City Baptist Church. Dont misunderstand, I believe we are to preach and testify, but, from what I understand no ones blood will be on my hands if they wind up in Hell. Ive told bits and pieces of my story here over the last couple of years, so dont want to travel back through all of that, suffice it to say I left a very legalistic IFB, and now find myself in a tiny, new work that a friend started about 4 years ago (about 20 on Sunday) he calls it a Baptist church, I spoke to him about taking the baptist title out of it, but he wouldnt have it. As for being responsible to share the gospel with those whom God has put in our path; our daily life should show we are different by our character and the way we live. They practice the Biblical teachings of separation as stated in Ephesians 5:11, which says, Have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. In Virginia, Baptist were not welcome. IndependentBaptist.com was founded in an attempt to bring back the principles that lifted our movement in the 60's and 70's and that need to be revived in this day. As long as they go to a God fearing church that believes in Jesus Christ and they themselves are not rebelling against God then it would not hurt my feelings if they went to Southern Baptist or Methodist churches. It is well also to note that these five distinctives are traits also of the true New Testament church! 3:1-16) However, some Independent Baptist churches do not accept that the word officer is the proper biblical term to be used and particularly does not apply to deacons. This was the first time in the history of the world that a government was established which granted religious freedom! You either comply or you are thrown out. The loved me and cared for my" But still, I think if I wanted to lead Worship wearing Just a speedo I probably would not be allowed to do this in most Churches. The New Testament teaches that Christ is the head of the church,(Eph. Independent fundamental Baptist churches include those loosely affiliated in fellowshipsmore common in the Northas well as those whose pastors may share particular networksmore common in. Being to poor to pay the fines he was banished from the colony. They have a 1st Amendment right to speak their mind, but that doesnt mean shouting down a preacher at a military funeral. It is an important part of the church. Christs death ushured in teh New Covenant where ceremonial law for the remission of sin is replaced with grace and mercy. I have also spend a good bit of down time ruminating over my beliefs of my church, and the fallacies of their theology. The message is set. I admitted, in my comment, that I was somewhat caustic in my writing (I could definitely get better in that department) but I re-read what I wrote and didnt think it was horrible. This is the biggest wrong teaching of the Churches of Christ, although you have lots of company in this wrong belief, it is still wrong teaching. Thats kind of like being an American and never knowing enough about the nations beginnings to be able to make an intelligent decision about whether some politician is leading us away from freedom. KJB,UNAFFILIATED. You can tell when people actually study their Bibles. A couple of things. This is the true heritage the Fundamental Baptists holds dear, there have always been assemblies which submitted themselves only to the sole authority of the Word of God. Im sure you realize all this, but I thought I would throw my voice in it. The cops accused them of urinating in the water. Ok, so Im pretty sure you are referring to the Church of Christ that was founded by good ol Thomas Campbell (1763-1854) He was a fine Scottish Presbyterian who left Ireland to come to western PA. in 1807. Baptists Briders, infer they can trace their history back to John the Baptist who was the first Baptist. I began my spiritual walk with Jesus studying the New Testament, but my journey through the Old Testament only reinforced my belief in the New and showed me more about God. G.L. Jesus Peace, Joy, and Guidance be with us all. You seems to be as blind as the Pharisees. Tithing is not for God. People who study dont fall so easily for false teaching. He is not nearly as fundy as where I left from, and is learning. Separation is not the problem. 2.) Greg all churches that suppoort Tithing as a good thing (incl IFB, CALVARLY CHAPEL, Many Non-Denominational Chruches,etc) Tithe a Tenth of thier income to building Gods Kingdom. G.L. Nor can I know the heart of those I preach to. These churches are good examples of Bible believing churches that existed independent of the Roman Catholic Church, and were for some time not corrupted by its influences. Robert Fry - Pastor of Bible Baptist Church in Plattsburgh, NY Deception; 75. Thank you for your help! It was horrible. Churches in USA; Churches in Canada; Churches in Australia; Churches in the UK; Churches Worldwide . I assume you are referring to the errant position that many Pastors, Deacons, or Elders have taken placing themselves between God & Man. 2 Timothy 2:24, And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient. Would you agree with me on this? 4.) The name Independent Fundamental Baptist Church is used traditionally by churches which pattern themselves strictly after the example of the early church as found in the New Testament. I do not agree with the IFB on their viewpoint of strict dress standards. Jesus didnt find it necessary to dress differently than anyone else, why should the MOG? Some IFB are good fellowships, some Plymouth Brethren Open) are good fellowships..etc. It is not the name or the organization that makes a Biblical church, but its practice of the faith as revealed in the New Testament. You can tell right away that something doesnt sound right. fundamental, Baptist, church. Even if a church blows the interpretation of verses like this and sets up what you refer to as a hierarchy, I feel you are in error to claim that God has no party with them, see for reference the 7 churches in Revelation which had great things going for them, but Christ had to deal with their errors. It is believed that God meant what he said in Revelation 22:18, the Scriptures were not to added to or taken from. Now I am in full agreement with you that we should support our places of worship with our monetary gifts, but a mandatory tithe for new testament christians? To fulfill something as in Jesus fulfilled the law means that it is satisfied, meaning that it is no longer needed. The word Independent means that the church is not a member of any council, convention or is a part of any hierarchy outside the local congregation. You have it backwards. Also, you keep mentioning Jesus statement about not leaving tithing undone. There was no hierarchy in the churches he founded, which were patterned after the simple New Testament example. 1.) I believe that the King James Version is the inspired, preserved Word of God for the English speaking people VICTORY BAPTIST CHURCH. . In 1906 there was a split with this group, some believing that there should be no musical instruments in the church (dont know where this got dreamed up, certainly didnt find it in the bible) This is when they started calling themselves the Churches of Christ. They were intolerant to anyone who did not agree to the authority of the Puritan church, which was supported by a governmental church tax of all the people. From a Calvary Chapel web site: We do not maintain church membership; You must be born again spiritually to join the church of Jesus Christ, therefore membership is in the whole church of Jesus, not just our local fellowship., This practice stems from their Moses model (top down) style of church leadership. In my civilian life..and please do pray for our military..I am very honored to serve as Senior Pastor of Coral Ridge in Jacksonville (FL). . It holds high the saving Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ, as revealed in the New Testament and an unwavering commitment to carrying out the Great Commission, that is, to teach everywhere the truth of Gods Word. Certainly we are not responsible for people we never have an opportunity to witness to. Hope that last wasnt too much personal info. They were then tarred and feathered and ran out of the county. In his writings he appears ignorant of the practices of the Roman Church and never refers to church councils, creeds, traditions or even to the existence of a pope. There were however, many Baptists who loved the Word of God and held true to it and refused to abandon teaching the New Testament. Updates? Im looking forward to laughing at more of your comments. Im calling into question yourreasoning as to why you are defending your belief about tithing. I watched a man die last week. The pastor's name is Kevin Draganac. Again adhering to correct doctrine and proper practices should be the focus in our lives. This would explain the abrasiveness with which you deliver what should be the most joyous information of the Gospel of Christ Jesus our Lord and Savior. 5. One of the last acts of the Presbyterians, before the Long Parliament in England fell, was to past a law passing the death penalty on anyone who was caught holding to what they called Eight Errors in Doctrine. These doctrines included infant baptism. Greg, Bob Just want to commend you on how clearly you are able to elucidate on a given topic, Im envious. Sure enough, Stedfast Baptist Church, founded in 2017, is not a large or well-known church. Baptist also believe the Bible interprets itself, and that Christ is the only head of the church. Member churches are forbidden to affiliate with any denomination, and the fellowship, administered by annually elected trustees, cannot . God uses us, to the extent that get out of His way.